What is the next move?

Based on the statements that were issued this weekend from all levels of government and the Pan Am organizing committee, is the next move for the city any clearer?

Comments

[Ed2]

Face it. Backwater Hayseeds do not produce a single good decision maker.

We have proven beyond a doubt that this is a complete waste of time and money. My bet is the entire stadium will cost at the very least $300,000,000.00 with environmental impact and ancillary studies.

Move on, fix up the existing downtown, and Randall Reef, and then look to the future of sports.

This priority of a stadium reminds me of Hurricane Katrina's damage to homes and small businesses in New Orleans and then the entire focus or recovery was to rebuild the SuperDome first.

Take care of home first before tackling the luxuries of society.

[guest]

All cities that want a professional sports franchise have to compromise. Most have to build the stadium, arena, etc and give revenue streams to the team in order to keep it or get it.
Otherwise the team goes to another city. Does Hamilton want a CFL franchise or not?

[Brian S.]

Wake up people. Bob Young is pulling the wool over our eyes. If you are the owner of the ti-cats, why pull out the day before the vote. Wouldn't you want to go to city hall and present you're case in front of council, the national media and the public. If you can produce documents showing that you are going to lose seven million a year, and council still pushes through the west harbour, you would have the public's support and sympathy. But there is no proof supporting you're claims, it's all talk. Councilors have been trying to get you to the table for days and you refuse. If you really want to keep the team in Hamilton, wouldn't you at least try again with the city. You lied on the radio today saying that Moncton has contacted you and been in talks. Reps in Moncton said they have not contacted the ti-cats and don't plan to. they don't want to be known as poachers who took the ti-cats out of Hamilton. I think you had a deal in the works with Milton months ago. How else do you explain the fact that once you mentioned the possibility of moving, reps from Milton were all over the t.v. with maps and stadium sites. They didn't throw that together in a couple of hours. So you were planning to move all along, but you couldn't just say i'm taking the team out of Hamilton because you would be the villain. This whole stadium fiasco has been invented so that you would have a scapegoat-- the mayor. Now if you leave you can say you were forced out and ti-cat fans will follow you to Milton. I have had season tickets for 30 years, and i will not go to another game if you take the team out of Hamilton. Shame on you Mr. Young.

[Dale]

RE: DBC_ parasite comment.
I have no control on how much rent is in my ward but as far as subsidized properties there are geared to income housing /lodging here as well as Hamilton Housing houses blended in surveys, No I do not walk to work BUT I do walk to Canadian tire/ 4 grocery stores wal-mart limeridge mall a variety of bars and eateries CAN YOU WALK TO THESE PLACES(this in itself is probably over 2000 jobs) with each business a major contributer to city revenue not to mention the property tax outside of wards 1 and 2 are 2 - 4 times higher so don't be saying the urban sprawl doe's nothing for the city.

[DBC]

RE: THE MOST IMPORTANT DATE FOR HAMILTON ONTARIO IS OCT 25 2010.On the 26Th of Oct. the outgoing City council will wake up and remember that The amalgamated City of Hamilton has more than one ward in it.

OK Dale. More than one ward eh? So tell me when your Ward is going to start doing its fair share and take some of the social services and second level lodging homes (currently gehottized and focused in Wards 1 and 2) to where they rightfully belong.........shared across our entire COMMUNITY!!!! You pompous windbags sicken me at times. If anyone needs to deamalgamate it's the lower city from the money sucking unsustainable urban sprawl that continues unabated all around us. I walk to work everyday........walk home for lunch too.....do you? Parasite.

[TripleV]

Did someone say Brad Clark is the only good one in city council?? bwa.... bwaha... bwahAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA

go ahead, vote for the loser again - he only got in through lying in his last campaign - you people are gluten for punishment.
P.S. Yes, BoB Young could go anywhere he wants, but he lived in Ivor Wynne for free - alot of you people forget that. What he paid out of his pocket is the money he lost because he doesnt know how to run a football team.. oh, and the nice flowers in the washrooms.

[Dan Logon]

This country is billions of dollars in debt and and the provincial and federal government is lining up to throw over a billion dollars at a second tier sporting event that there is little interest in.At the same time Ontario residents are having close to half their wages taken from them in the form of various taxes. There should be strong opposition to these games and the funding of a new stadium to any extent in Hamilton where the main benefeciary is a Billionaire who has mismanaged his football team since obtaining it in 2003. In addition to this hospitals in rural Ontario are in desperate need of funding for medical facilities. I expect the media to champion the use of existing facilities for these games and exposing the hyprocisy.
I guess David Peterson likes to have his picture taken during ribbon cutting ceremonies.

[Tom Robertson]

This latest move to remove the mayor from dealing with the Pan am committee is just another example of some councilors showing what buffoons they are. They can't get it through their thick skulls that this is about bringing Pan am games events to Hamilton and not about filling Bob Young's pockets. Council now should be showing a united front to support the games. The babble you are spouting now will leave you with the asterisk that you took lead in causing Hamilton to not be participating and not getting the funding to build a stadium. Do flip floppers and Bob Young *** kissers Whitehead and Jackson have a business plan to build a stadium and clean up the the west harbour site without federal and provincial money.

[James Scearce]

All these people who are mad at City Council sure are smart.

They're right. We should just give $250,000,000 taxpayer dollars (hey, that's a quarter billion dollars) to the Hamilton Tiger-Cats and let them do whatever they want with it, because they are geniuses with cash. Because the CFL is such a great investment, it's a money making machine.

How come the Montreal Alouettes can survive in a tiny old run down stadium but Bob Young (the billionaire) needs hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayer cash to make a go of it in Hamilton? Why would City Council dare question that?

Has anyone asked Bob Young why he can't just build his own stadium? From what I read he has more money than City Council. Why should the city prop up his business?

Some people are so smart it boggles my mind. We are probably not giving the Tiger-Cats and the CFL enough taxpayer money, I think all revenue from the City of Hamilton should go to the Tiger-Cats, so they can spend the money more wisely than those fools at City Hall. Anyone smart enough to buy a CFL team surely knows a wise investment when they see it.

[Jason]

What amazes me most is the former voice of the Tiger Cats voted for this.

Hamilton DOES NOT deserve this team any longer and I hope it moves to aplace it is appreciated. I'll still support it.
It is typical of this town to dump on an owner that has invested millions and does not even live there.
It is shameful and typical. For some reason people generally do not treat people well in Hamilton.

[Dale]

THE MOST IMPORTANT DATE FOR HAMILTON ONTARIO IS OCT 25 2010.On the 26Th of Oct. the outgoing City council will wake up and remember that The amalgamated City of Hamilton has more than one ward in it.

[P. Stevens]

To Tom Robertson
Yes, the city has been so honest and above board, haven't they? They have admitted that they cooked the figures for the east mountain. They consented to a facilitation process that they had no intention of giving any consideration to. I don't believe that the clean up cost of the west harbour will be 3 million dollars either. They have held back room negotiations with Katz, who is not that well thought of out in Edmonton. Yup, the city have been real straight shooters, not.

[Tom Mountenay]

I don't believe this city and it's politicians. We will end up losing the ticats because our politicians are so short sighted, possibly because of thier heads being up thier butts.Bob Young saved the ticats from extinction and what does he get, he's viified everywhere. Our braintrust wants to build a stadium over a toxic dump and build it without a major tennant. Does anyone really believe the Pan Am comittee is going to spend this money on a white elephant. I am a seaon ticket holder and when they move to Milton or Burlington I will continue to be one. I moved out of this city 9 years ago because of the jerks running it then and continuing to raise taxes. Now the new jerks are running around with thier heads burried up thier rears and are talking about increasing taxes to continue with this fiasco. I can see why Bob Young is a rich man and these clowns are politicians trying to get rich off the taxpayers. I hope they all get a job filling in for Ronald McDonald after the taxpayers vote them out.

[Michael]

Perhaps it's finally time to stop Stelco and Dofasco (or whoever they are these days) from spewing poison into our air; it's clearly rotted the brains of the majority of Spec readers.

Leave aside the "anchor tenant" issue. What is (very temporary) Mayor Fred going to tell the Pam Am games committee about Herman Turkstra? If your memories don't extend back so far as to remember the Spec article, he will tie up the stadium at the OMB for, at the very least, half a year (remember how pursuasive y'all found that argument when it was used in respect of the east mountain?).

Oh yeah, based upon the fact that the City has endorsed two documents which state the west harbour is inappropriate for a stadium, Herman actually might win at the OMB.

Does anyone really think that the Pam Am committee will wait over six months to sort that out?

All of your school yard whining about how Bob Young refused to lose millions of dollars for the rest of his life on an economic doghouse of a stadium doesn't change the facts.

Bye, bye stadium. Bye, bye (very temporary) Mayor Fred.

[Peter Michael]

Kathy, the only lucky (or smart) councilor of the bunch was Brad. He's the only current local politician that may survive the next election.

But then maybe he wasn't that lucky as I'm torn between what would be worse; sitting at that council meeting or attending the Bublee concert...

[Mike]

Oh, what a city we live in. Hey, let's build a stadium without a major tenant, just out of spite. We won't get the Pan Am games, but hey we showed our 'dignity' by sticking with West Harbour. Meanwhile, the great Bob Young - who doesn't really need the City of Hamilton half as much as it needs him-will just build his own stadium in Aldershot. It will be accessible for loyal Cat fans from the Hammer, and Hamilton taxpayers will not pay a cent. Eisenberger will have lost the stadium, the Pan Ams, and the Tiger Cats... and he'll probably still get voted back in!

P.S. Take a look at us NHL!! This is how we treat our professional sports teams. Another reason for Bettman to turn around and laugh at us.

[Tom Robertson]

I think Ron Foxcroft owes Council, City staff and the Citizens an apology for the rude and crude statements he made on a Toronto radio station yesterday.He made more of a fool of himself than he did of council. Ron I thought you were a fair man with a reputation as a wise businessman. Would you make a 100 milion dollar deal with someone using the tactics Young and Mitchell used? Would you make this huge deal with someone who refused to open there financial records to prove their need or financial wherewithal to complete the deal? Would you make a deal with someone who had a secret website to elicit negative comments about you and then posted on this site letters from organizations like the United Way thanking him for his support of their programs but he called these letters from them as supporting the east mountain site. These organizations forced him to remove those letters. Would you continue with a deal with someone constantly changed the rules at the last minute? Would you make a big deal with someone who claims to have a business plan and development partners but would not reveal them to you? Obviously you were not at the Council meeting to hear the financial reports from a diligent staff laying out the huge difference in costs to build on the east mountain and how much money the taxpayers would lose though development fees and yearly property tax revenue if the site was not left for private development. Today Mr. Young issued a public statement saying the Pan Am games will fail unless he gets his way. I believed you were a big supporter of Hamilton but do you support The Cats position of ill will towards the games? I am sure you followed the long saga of the Red Hill Expressway and how it was held up for years for environmental assessments and appeals. This will occur at the east mountain site and by time this issue is resolved it will be too late to build a stadium on time for the games. Since you were quick to go on a Toronto radio station to make your attacks you will be brave enough post here your proof that Council deserves the epithets you threw at them and maybe sit down with Andrew Dreschel to discuss your views. You may have noticed all the sports reporters are backing Mr. Young's position. Could that have anything to do with the hospitality given to them by the Cats as I am sure they are well fed and plied with drinks at Ti-cat games and events and would not want to lose these perks if they were banned from the stadium for disagreeing with their Master and being reassigned the beat of covering senior citizen events

[Peter]

With idiots running the asylum we can kiss so many things goodbye: the TiCats, Pan Am funding, what little respect we had around Canada - seeing as we are now the laughing stock, any hopes for an NHL franchise, and business relocating or setting up shop in the city. City Council couldn't make a right decision if their life depended on it. Too many blame Bob Young as being inflexible yet it was City Council who ignored any other stadium site proposal except West Harbour. They are the true bullies and their ignorance and short sightedness is going to cost this city for years to come. They expect Mr. Young to lose money for their vision. Congrats Freddy and your merry band of incompetant idiots. You people finally made a decision - there had to be a first - and you made the wrong one! You scare business away with your indecision and small town rhetoric. With absolutely no business acumen you constantly try to appease the whiney vocal minority. Try listening to successful businessmen for once and you may start to get something right. Yet, you listen to bs arguments and rhetoric; not unlike the pro WH comments here. So please, all of you bask in your ignorance and stupidity!

[Manny]

No wonder business are leaving Hamilton and new ones are not knocking at our door. Are taxes are too high and we're and city councel are a pain in the ass to deal with.

[Tom Robertson]

Council and staff will have to get busy immediately to show the Pan-Am committee they have the initiative to make the stadium a success. Soccer Canada should be contacted to see if they would have any interest in setting up base at the stadium. as the training centre for men's and woman's under 20 and under 18 teams. I am sure exhibition games featuring a Canadian team against teams from Italy and Portugal would be sellouts. There would be more games played than the Cats would be playing. Also with the world class velodrome nearby the Canadian Cycling Association should also be contacted about operating out of Hamilton. These 2 groups could then share setting up some facilities for medical and exercise rooms. Also it should be reported to them the affordability of rent for the athletes compared to other Canadian cities and the waterfront trail as an ideal location for jogging. Michael Buble could also hold a concert at the stadium each night Council is meeting. There are other initiatives Council and staff could come up with like professional soccer or other outdoor sports. Bob Young's Cat's could never be considered a legacy tenant but more of a homesteader who doesn't pay rent and collects a 1.3 million dollar welfare check every year. Negotiations with the Katz group should be expedited.

[ernest]

I'm with Sam Merulla.No new stadium,fix up the the old football one.costs way less, ask for more from the ticats .After that tell the provincial and fed government to hand over the promised $$$$.then tell em to beat it we lied and all is good.and of course we are sorry for lying there must have been a miss communication and leave it at that.problem solved!

[Kathy Hagan]

Well I sat through the whole 11 hour meeting yesterday and I applaud the speakers who spoke so eloquently and heartfelt on their love of Hamilton and its core and their support for west Harbor.
However, I believe it is a decision that will go nowhere.
Without a prime tenant Hamilton will be unable to fund this stadium,and so ultimately we will not have a stadium in that area unless some cooperate entity comes forward.

Brad Clarke should be booted out for not voting and for wasting time grilling the city finance staffer when he knew he would not be voting.
Most of the public and speakers stayed the whole time surely our elected representative could have done the same.
Bob Bratina attempted three times to get the council to read a Glossy Brochure from Vrancore one of his cohorts who is promising to build a stadium and condos etc. {The same person who owns the HMP property and old federal building that continues to be an eyesore.}
In my opinion Mr Young saw his opportunity to make the city a scapegoat and he planned to leave when the lease was up at Ivor if he didn't get concessions.
As it stands Mayor Eisenberger did all he could and why would we put Confederation Park back on the table, do we want 18 - 20 acres of that area lost to a stadium?
I hope the West harbor brownfield site at least receives a clean up and all the property surrounding it.
That is the best legacy for our children and grandchildren.

[James Scearce]

I just sent this email to Bob McCown, so he can better understand the situation here in Hamilton...

Bob, there are a lot of dummies who cover sports... but you and Stephen Brunt aren't two of them.

During your chat with Mr Brunt yesterday, Stephen hit then nail on the head when he mentioned parking revenue as the basic difference between the two proposed stadium sites.

Simply put, the East Mountain location Mr Young prefers is geographically similar to the Corel Centre in Ottawa and the West Harbour location is more akin to the ACC in Toronto... not exactly, but you get the picture.

The money Mr Young was willing to invest in East Mountain was essentially to build a parking lot for 6,000 cars... and I'm pretty sure parking wasn't going to be free. This makes business sense for Mr Young and no one can fault him for that. But it really yeilds nothing for the over one hundred million dollar investment Hamilton City Council was being asked to make. Not to mention the millions the feds and Dalton were kicking in.

The East Mountain site makes better business sense for the Tiger-Cats and the CFL... but they aren't really paying one cent for a shiny new stadium, the taxpayers are. List for me the number of new stadiums that are being built by taxpayers in this country that the CFL can play in... and the CFL has the audacity to get upset that the taxpayers aren't building a stadium that meets their economic needs?

If you can't afford to build your own stadiums, if you require taxpayer subsidies... it's incumbent on you to play ball with the government, not the other way around.

The Tiger-Cats and the CFL may have just blown the chance for a brand new taxpayer built stadium. No one ever accused the CFL of being a beacon of solid business practices, but they may have reached a new pinnacle here.

[erin]

mark d., for someone who no longer lives here, why so grumpy? did you forget to have your juice?

[Mark]

Interesting link from the Toronto Star by Damien Cox (a Hamilton boy).

http://thestar.blogs.com/thespin/2010/08/pointless-threats.html

[Disappointed in Bob Young]

To all you Tiger Cat Fans, How can you not be outraged at Bob Young for even talking about moving the team. This suggests that your loyalty to the team through thick and think is not mearly important enough for him to keep the team in hamilton.

If I were Bob Young, I would pay to build my own stadium on the east mountain and run it on my own. Personally I am disgusted that all my support for the team is wasted in knowing the high potential is there for the team to leave.

This is not about the mayor, this is about a team owner who wants to leave because he isnt getting his way and showing that our loyalty just doesn't cut it.

[Mark]

I think some of the people here actually like being bullied by Barking Bob. Nothing like having someone dominant let you know your place in life, it`s sad but the majority find this kind of behavior from a so called leader re-assuring. Read Escape From Freedom by Erich Fromm written in the 1940`s. Stand behind Barking Bob and his laundry, I mean team, for when he and they are strong that makes little worthless scared me strong as well! So so sad... My Hamilton is much more than this bullying, threatening man... and your Hamilton could be so much more too.

[James Scearce]

It is funny to read all the doom and gloom from the people who are upset that the City Of Hamilton didn't jump at the chance of providing billionaire Bob Young over $100,000,000 public dollars for a stadium in Satellite City where Bob would throw in a parking lot on his dime and charge for the privelige of parking there.

The City of Hamilton didn't blow this... Bob Young and the CFL are blowing this. The CFL should build their own stadiums if they want total control on where they are built. But we all know the CFL or the Tiger-Cats simply can't afford to build their own stadiums, they rely heavily on the taxpayers in this regard.

One sports reporter I absolutely resepct is Hamilton's own Stephen Brunt, a very smart guy for the world of sports. He hit the nail on the head talking to Bob McCown on the FAN590 this evening.

Brunt pointed out the reason Bob Young wants this stadium on Stoney Creek mountain is for the parking revenue, pure and simple. It's a revenue stream he can't control at Ivor Wynne where people park on streets, lawns and take public transportation. It's guaranteed money at the out of town site, no one will walk to that stadium.

So you see, Bob Young doesn't care one iota about what's best for Hamilton. He wants the city to fork over $100,000,000 and millions more from federal and provincial tax money so he can charge you more to get to ten Tiger-Cats games per year. That's some legacy.

City Council should be applauded for not being intimidated by this. If Hamilton did this for every business in town, well, there wouldn't be enough money in the world to satisfy all these businesses who want the taxpayers to build their places of operation for them.

[Ray]

The way I look at it. If I want to sell my house and move somewhere else I could look anywhere I wanted and I could.

If a business wants to move to a different location because they can make more money in a better location, they could as well.

My question is why is City Hall dictating to Bob Young and the Tiger Cats where they HAVE to move to. Aren't they (Tiger Cats)allowed to make their own decision? Or have Councillors become so accustom to ramming decisions down people's throats about what they think is best for the city whether anyone else likes it or not.

Are they forgetting elections are coming? Time for an overhaul.

[Justin Thyme]

Somehow, council forgot one important fact. Bob has many options, up to and including moving the team. It's not blackmail, it's reality. Everyone is allowed to consider all of their options in a democratic country. Bob is not taking his ball and going home, he is taking his ball and pursuing other alternatives,somewhere else. The problem is, Fred backed himself into a corner, where he has no options, no back door. If you want to play in the big league, you play by their rules. Fred, your playing small-town politics.

[Justin Thyme]

The only pole that counts, the only vote that matters, is the one from your wallet. To determine where the stadium should go, let the seasons' ticket holders decide. Offer season's tickets with three options - tickets for WH, refundable only if the stadium is not built there; tickets for the EM, refundable on the same terms; or season's tickets for either location, non refundable. I don't recall anyone at the rallies for either side putting their money where their mouth is, and committing to supporting the team by purchasing season's tickets.

[Kevin]

Pan Am Fan
Yes i was at the meeting and yes they would like to go full steam ahead, But with no tenant, no money for Pan am no Pan am no stadium, ,

"In Toronto tonight, at the ACC they are laughing at Hamilton," Clark wrote in an e-mail to The Spectator. "Everyone HERE agrees the stadium will now go to York University."

Hope that clears it up for you

[Myopinion]

All those people siding with Bob Young, saying they are business owners and know how he feels; why don't you treat the city as a business? Which in fact it is. If the city accepts the east mountain site, it would lose millions in development charges and taxes for prime commercial land. Probably way more than what the ti-cats would pay to lease the stadium. Not only that but the big box stores that will eventually go there, create good paying jobs for the people of Hamilton. Take your emotions out of this decision and use logic.

[Nelson Phillips]

Hamilton.......

In the year 2016,if TiCats are still alive
If women can survive, we may find

In the year 2026
Ain't gonna need to tell the truth & throw no sticks
Everything you think, do and say
Is in the pills they took yesterday

In the year 2036
You ain't gonna need your teeth, won't need your eyes
City Hall will find things to chew
Nobody's gonna look at you

In the year 2046
Your arms hangin' limp at your sides
Your legs got nothin' to do
Some Councilor doin' that for you

In the year 2056
You won't need a husband, won't need a wife
City Hall will pick your son, pick your daughter too
From the bottom of an empty LRT tube

In the year 2066
If God's a-coming, He oughta make it by then
Maybe He'll look around Himself and say
"Guess it's time for the judgement day"

In the year 2066 plus ten
God is gonna shake His mighty head
He'll say "I'm hate where the Stadium has been"
Tear it down, and start again

In the year 2110
I'm kinda wonderin' if we've been here again

We've taken everything this old City can give
And we ain't put back nothing

Now it's been one hundred years years, Hamilton's cried a billion tears
For what, we never knew, Now Fred's reign is through
But through eternal night, the twinkling of starlight
So very far away, maybe it's only yesterday and in October we'll get it RIGHT!!!!!

[Robbie]

Now is the time that the league should step in and insist that Bob Young sell the team. It should be sold to the fans. 500,000 shares @ $20 each.
Then we will see how much the people of Hamilton and Ontario want the Cats.

[Pan Am Fan]

@ Kevin,

If you were at the meeting at city hall they stated that with or without the ti-cats, the staduim and games will still go full speed ahead.

[Super Nova]

Hamilton prestige, in this country, is embodied in their pro-football team, the Hamilton Tiger-Cats. Now that Hamilton Council has successfully "run-off" the Ti-Cats, the city will have finally realized its destiny. You will be nothing to Canadians. Just an insignificant rump of the GTA. Hang Your Head Hamilton!

[Dump Breath]

@Mark D. Stoke City FC has been around since 1863!

[P. Stevens]

The next move? We can't attract business to this city already, do you think they will come after seeing how Bob Young has been treated by the Spectator, the mayor, city council and some of the citizens?
Bloggers are putting their own spin on Bob Young's part in this affair. The east mountain site was a compromise for him, a word, I might say is not in the vocabulary of the mayor or city council, he was in favour or Confederation Park as were many other Hamiltonians. The city and the mayor chose the site early on and never for a minute considered any where else. Bob Young has made many suggestions for the west harbour and has offered money for those ideas and for remediation of the site but none of his suggestions were ever considered. The west harbour would be good for condos, parks, restaurants, ect, just not for a stadium. By the way, no one knows the real cost of remediating the west harbour, I suspect that we have been lied to about that.
Bob Young has spent millions of his own money on buying the team, making Ivor Wynn habitable and on his operating losses, why is he vilified for wanting to recoup some of his money? On top of that his portion promised to expand the new stadium would be 15 million dollars. Do any of you commenters have any where near that much at stake here? I just hope that Young relocates close enough that I can continue to support "our" team. I can tell you one thing, it won't be in downtown Burlington or Oakville, it will be near the highway at a visible location. It's getting harder to be proud of being a Hamiltonian all the time.

[Mullah_Kintyre]

Bob Young's problem is that the incompetently-run CFL sets its teams up
to lose money. He complains that the Ticats have been losing money for many years. So Bob, please explain to all of us why, during this recent off-season after its CBA expired, the CFL elected to inexplicably INCREASE its salary cap from $4.2 million to $4.5 million per team in the next 3 years. That means the average player is being paid more than $5000 per game, and I've read claims elsewhere that it's actually over
$6000 per per game on average.

The Arena Football League pays $400 a game. If one player leaves, there
are dozens lined up behind him willing to take his place. The CFL could
reduce its salary cap to $1 million per team and still easily be out-paying that. Imagine that. The CFL could actually have had all of
its teams earning a profit, but instead chose to continue losing money
and trying to dupe gullible municipal governments into paying for their incompetence.

The new CFL stadium proposals rely on ancillary businesses (such as shopping malls, etc.) to be attached to the stadium to earn a profit to fund the money-losing football team. That's what B.S.ing Bob means when he complains that he won't be able to make money downtown and needs a suburban stadium. Sorry, Bob, but that's just a completely idiotic way
to run a professional football team. And the people of Hamilton and
every CFL fan should tell B.S.ing Bob Young and the other incompetent
guys who run the CFL that their league will not be successful until they
get their act together and stop relying on government handouts.

The people of Hamilton should be proud that their city council did not
cave in to this idiocy. For the gullible people here claiming that Bob
Young is going to move the team -- how stupid do you think we are?
Please explain what other incredibly gullible city is all set to fork over $160 million or more to give Bob Young his own new suburban 28,000 seat stadium? There is nowhere for him to move.

As others have stated here already, even if B.S.ing Bob folds his team
out of spite, the Daryl Katz group have already stated they love the
West Harbour site and are interested in having a pro soccer team there. The Pan Am soccer stadium could then be smaller and soccer-specific, and
therefore very likely be paid for entirely with the money that has
already been pledged by the 3 levels of government. It would not need
another $60 million to be converted into a 28,000 seat CFL stadium --
and no one, B.S.ing Bob or anyone else, has explained yet where this
extra $60 million would be coming from.

[Amanda Pepin]

First, let's applaud the City Council for standing behind their initial decisions...perhaps there is some backbone after all. With precious little green space left in this city, let's preserve what we do have left so our children may breathe in the future.

Second, Mr. Young needs to focus less on WHERE the Ticats play and more on HOW they play. And if he wants to act like a spoiled child rather than a loyal Hamiltonian...Good-bye and good riddance. Unfortunately, he doesn't realize that his actions are portraying him as selfish and more concerned with his own bottom line than that of the welfare of our hometown.

Third, this is an awful lot of debate over something that could potentially only generate short-term employment opportunities and short-term revenue increase. Construction only lasts until the stadium is built and the revenue only comes in when it is used. Beyond that, it is the citizens' tax dollars paying for it all.

I can easily think of 100 things where the money can be better spent, so if it falls through, maybe the Council will ask the citizens of our fine city where we would like to see the money put before they make future decisions. I'd rather see children eat and our city thrive long-term than the Pan-Am games.

[Peter Michael]

"Clean and Green in 2015!"

I obviously have no idea what this is all about but there is no way Hamilton will be Clean and Green in 2015. Almost as big a joke as the stadium decision yesterday.

The only thing we will have in 2015 after the PanAm games (if the stadium thing goes through in the west harbour) is an empty stadium.

Big and Empty in 2016! (with a legacy tax increase for all the taxpayers to remind them of the idiocy of a former city council).

[J]

"What is the next move"?
I know what my next move is in October!

[Harv]

The next move is Goodbye Ticats, Then goodbye Stadium and pan am, Yhen hopefully its Bye Bye Mayor Fred and all his muppets

[Jay]

Cool, so in the end.. to summarize, they scared a legacy football team away, and voted on an unrealistic site that plays into downtown's heartstrings, and there won't be a stadium there because it won't get funded without a tenant, so we might as well say goodbye to pan-am also.

So, now we have less than we came into this with. They just don't know when to quit.

And, LOL @ this idea of "multi-use". I'm sure the 450 fans that attend the 16,000 seat arena the bulldogs play in, would love to go and watch soccer too.

*shakes head at all of this idiocy*

[Mark D.]

To "taxpayer"....you're only partly correct. Hamilton as a "city" was established in 1846 when George Hamilton bought the former Durand farm in what is now the Durand neighbourhood behind City Hall, while the Cats were formed in 1869, so the city was NOT around that much longer than the team, so check your info before opening your obviously misinformed mouth! If you people think for one second that the Pan-Am group will have anything to do with the city now, you're dreaming again! One hundred and forty-one years of football history is now threatened thanks to a short-sighted and obviously corrupt council. Hamilton is a dump and will remain a dump. Congratulations! I'm so glad I don't live in this lunch-bucket town any longer! At least my taxes won't be contributing to the real "mistake by the lake", the City of Hamilton!

[ernest]

Can't wait to see all the *art* spray painted on the walls of our new stadium."keenur" is gunna have a heyday!

[Gene Simmons]

Well, in defence of the city, has anyone been paying attention to the construction of the new MacNab Street Transit Terminal? It's looking very good...and hopefully the thoughtless swine amongst us can refrain from littering, spitting, dropping cigarette butts (or how about a NO SMOKING ANYWHERE ON PLATFORM policy??), doing graffiti, etc. so that we can keep it looking good. Very classy. It's supposed to be done by September and I can't wait!!

[outtamyway]

Some people are moaning about how Hamilton's identity is wrapped up in the Ti-Cats, and now that the Ti-Cats are refusing to play ball, that we stand to lose the soul of Hamilton.

That couldn't be further from the truth.

Listen to the impassioned words of Matt Jelly in support of the West Harbour and the City.

Listen to that kid (who must have been about 13, and was obviously speaking in public for the first time).

That is the soul of Hamilton. Not steel plants. Not the football team. It's the people.

The people have spoken.
Clean and Green in 2015!

[Kevin]

Pan Am fan,

It don't really matter now they have no Tenant for WH so nothing will be built. As for Brad Clark you can stand behind Freddy in the unemployment line, Unreal Birthday comes before your appointed Duty.

[Emmalene Pruden]

I say good riddance to Young. Not because I want to lose the Ticats, but because of the way he carried himself in this situation.

I was for the West Harbour site, yes, but I honestly would not stamp my feet and refuse to go to the east mountain location if it had ended up there.

I have no illusions that this stadium is going to 'fix' downtown, but it is part of the solution - we just can't let the ball stop rolling or revitalization will never happen.

I am proud of city council. They did their job. They worked for the people of Hamilton.

Need I remind everyone that there ARE other sports out there than football that could easily make use of the stadium. Don't be so quick to give up.

[Dale]

I am not a fan of any level of politics but Today I am embarrassed with each and every council member of Hamilton.After reports and viable findings of proper location for the stadium they go against all findings for the sake of downtown. yes the downtown truly needs revitalizing but you don't add to the problem you fix whats there. start with Copps coliseum/ jackson square/ parking/ abandoned buildings/ proper policing/ get people interested in up keeping their properties get the downtown to be proud then introduce new venues to this area. Do I have to remind the councilors that Hamilton is Now the amalgamated City of Hamilton and that some of the great things that can happen to Hamilton such as new businesses/ restaurants/festivals and other various events DO not always have to pertain to downtown all area's of the amalgamated City of Hamilton could use revitalization and a sense of pride in each and all neighbourhoods. At this point I actually hope the federal and provincial governments refuse the funding for the pan am events so that another under used stadium/ arena/building does not become a tax payers burden down the line.

[Mark D.]

Way to go Hamilton....you're destroying the oldest sports franchise in history! Great job! Now all of you can get in line at the unemployment office because if Hamiltonians have any love for the history and reputation of this once-great town, they'll send these idiots packing in the next election. And for all you Tiger-Cat haters on this blog, you are the most stupid people I've ever had the misfortune to hear from! You do not deserve professional sports of any kind in this city. I hope the Cats and the Bulldogs take a walk. Who wouldn't when they're treated like this? You should, and will, be ashamed of yourselves when the Cats, the Pan-Am Games, and the money disappears thanks to your misguided politicians, and Hamilton will just become an even larger garbage dump!

[Taxpayer]

Finally council does something that makes sense.
If this means goodbye TiCats because their threats failed, good riddance. Hamilton was here long before them and will be here long after they have been relegated to the great sports garbage dump in the sky

[Tom]

What a pile from loco elected politicians. The only thing Hamilton was noted for was the Ti-Cats.The laughing stock of all cities in Canada. The truth is out how ridiculous Hamilton is being run. What are the residents going to do in a couple of years with no football team and 2(Copps)big white elephants to pay for. Local residents will be whining like pigs when their enormous taxes will force them out of the city. Get out while you can Bob and leave this mess to Hamilton. They deserve it.

[Kevin]

I cant belive it. Bye Bye cats, Did anyone listen to Ron Foxcroft on the fan 590 yesterday. So no team no pan am no freddy next election, and they had the nerve to all vote to go kiss youngs rear end now that the vote was in unreal

[Pan Am Fan]

Anyone, Please correct me if I am wrong but something that has been burning on my mind is that the Pan-Am stadium is going to be a soccer stadium which means the field will have to meet the dimensions of a soccer field. Now if the tiger cats ever used it after the games, wouldnt the field have to meet the dimensions of a cfl field, because I dont think a CFL field and soccer field are the same dimensions so is that allowed and how would you accomodate both in terms of field dimension?.

If anyone could answer that would be greatly appreciated.

thanks.

[Tom Robertson]

I would love to be a fly on the wall when Brad Clark is explaining to his boss in a private sector job that while the company was in a critical crisis he couldn't be there because a concert was more important. He would be celebrating his birthday being unemployed. A lot of people in this city grew up working or with family working shift work 7 days a week missing many occasions due to work obligations. I'm sure your wife could have found someone else to attend the concert and then celebrate your birthday at a later at one of the great dining establishments in the city. Make sure you put in your campaign platform that family birthdays hold a higher priority than critical city business. I am looking forward for you to make media statements to explain your absence to the taxpayers who are your employer.

[Brian]

This is a free country and I believe in democracy.I thought the east mountain was the place to build.After watching and listening to the mayor, councellors and Hamiltonians since this morning they have made their decision and I respect them for it.
Well Bob I guess you will have to decide if you are a Hamiltonian and also respect the voting process.You talked about how you grew up and watched the ticats and talking to my grandchildren tonight, they would also like to go to the game to see the Hamilton Tiger Cats play.If you don't want to support Hamilton then put the team up for sale rather than moving them.I have respected you for many years and will in the future only if you beleive in democracy.
In reality I think the city will be farther ahead by doing what they think is best for the city
Who needs to be bullied like that.
Bet you were bullied as a child Bob.
How did you like it?

[John]

The Mayor and councelors did the right thing, they did what was best for Hamilton, although unpopular to Bob Young's Tiger Cats and their fans. Bob wanted, the east mountain site, so he could reap the profits from parking etc. why would HE make that money and not the city, which built it? Tax dollars will pay to build it and the city should make the money from parking, concessions etc.
As for Brad Clark? You thought your own birthday was more important than the biggest issue counsel has faced in years? A concert? Give me a break, sounds more like you ran from the issue to me. I hope your constituents remember that.
The rest stayed and stood for what they thought was best for the city, one way or another, they ALL have my respect, but you? None!

[West Harbour support]

Congratulations Mayor Fred, you stood up to the greedy cats head Bob Young and told him we arent going to take his crap. Its about time we had a mayor who stood up for us hamiltonians.

By the way to all you west harbour haters, if you actually came to the meeting at city hall, you would have realsed throughout the day that the east mountain is not a viable option

[ben]

It's about time this is over. Happy to see a sports team of any kind will not be able to get away with trying to play the heavy. Bottom line, the stadium to be built was for the city, not a losing team. It's being built for the event, and will be filled in any way the city shall please, with or without the ti-cats. Actually after all is said and done, maybe the ti-cats if they care to stay in hamilton should be bannished from any possibility of playing at the new stadium and told to keep their dirty old stadium.

[Peter]

King James...

Since you already know the prices Bob Young would have charged at an East Mountain Stadium, you obviously have a gift of seeing into the future! So, please tell me the winning numbers for the next LotoMax draw this Friday. You also seem to know Bob Young's intentions so you definitely are a talented man. As for calling Mr. Young's bluff...it is no bluff. Losing millions each year is not the goal of any business but you don't even see that side of the equation. All you see is what you want to see, and what you think will happen. So continue to support the TiCats until the end of 2011; after which I am sure they will leave. Then you won't have to worry about spending any amount of money on parking, beer, or game tickets!

[Mike]

I find this truly embarassing. That big egos involved with this decision are so blinded, that they can't see right from wrong. I suspect none of them knows what's involved with running a business. And the quotes are even more embarassing. "If they can't walk from here..." Really... Did he say that? Idiot.
This will be one ugly white elephant just like Montreal has. And guess who will be holding the bill?

For a city that can't afford proper plumbing, this is the last thing we need.

[J]

Say goodbye to Mayor Fred!

[Gary Mitchell]

Fred , get your head out of your ass and wake up . The core is dead , and has been for the last 30 years , you should know this , being in real estate before politics .Why are you still barking up a dead tree ?

[James Scearce]

Pigskin Peter...

You've fallen for Bob Young's bluff. Who else is going to build a stadium for Bob for free?

The CFL only works in 8, sometimes 9 Canadian cities. Hamilton has been one of them for years and Hamilton is about to build a brand new stadium (with provincial and federal funds), it's not a market the CFL can afford to leave, they don't have that many options.

If Bob Young is dumb enough to leave this established CFL market with it's brand new publically funded stadium and take a chance elsewhere, good luck to him. Let Bob Young build his own stadium and rent it to the Pan-Am games... oh wait, that will never happen, Bob Young has absolutely no intention of spending one penny on a stadium... he will spend money on a parking lot he can charge you $20 to park in.

BTW, I live 6 blocks from Ivor Wynne and attend Cats games and have been a season ticket holder. I have no intention of spending $70 for a game out of town in Satellite City, paying $20 for parking, spending $40 for four beers and then getting nailed for impaired at the corner of Stone Church and Pritchard. I will enjoy a leisurely day in and around the downtown and waterfront area and take in a ball game too.

Keep falling for Bob's bluff... hopefully I meet you at a poker table at Casino Niagara in the future.

[Maggie]

We have a very short memory in Hamilton when it comes to political interferance.The Progressive Conservatives have hit us twice. Once provincally and now federally.I believe they do this because we appear to delight in having people divide our city rather than uniting us.Our councillors spend most of there time trying to keep their jobs that they forget to do their jobs.Thankyou Mayor Eisenberger for doing your job. He has done his best to protect the future fund and our tax dollars by doing what is best for the city of Hamilton.
I am tired of spoiled millionaires and billionaires making decisions about where my tax dollars are spent, always to their benefit.
I hope that we can still convince the province and the feds to leave their money in place so the community can utilize this new stadium.

[Gene Simmons]

Can we move on now? Okay, who thinks Naomi Campbell is lying about the diamonds? If she is, do you think she deserves jail time??

[Dr. Shart]

Maybe it's time to abandon the city & set up shop elsewhere like the Ti-Cats. Tired of being the "armpit" of Ontario but I guess it's better than Malton who is know as the rectum of earth!!

[Jay]

@ Ottawa RoughRider fan.... You said it. This guy wants to be known as the guy that built "the Fred Eisenberger West Harbour Stadium" at whatever possible cost and little future outlook.

We have 2 sites that we are equally divided upon as a people (seen the polls?), and there is OUR ELECTED mayor at a rally for one of them over the weekend. Glad to see our leader is not slanted.

Then he says.. "Let's go to lunch, democracy takes time". LOL!!!!

[Ottawa RoughRider fan]

Nice legacy for Eisenberger to be known as the mayor who forced the Ticats to leave town.

[GIVE ME LIBERTY]

I can only hope that the Pan Am games leave town with the Tiger Cats. That would be the ACTUAL first step to revitalizing Hamilton. End corporate welfare of the Tiger Cats. Don't listen to Dalton's cozy thoughts about the Tiger Cats being the main attraction of this city. That guy is a socialist and you KNOW if he says something is a good idea, it means DEBT, LOSS OF LIBERTY, NO ACCOUNTABILITY. Don't forget the lessons we've been taught by trusting Dalton "I won't raise taxes" MacGuinty!

[Peter]

James: something tells me you don't attend TiCat games. Comments posted in favour of an East Mountain site are not by fictitious people. They are made by concerned citizens who have based their opinion on fact. I have read your comments and yours are non sensical and ludicrous. WH supports fail to see the big picture. We are losing respect around Canada and from potential businesses coming to the city. How many WH supporters actually regularly attend games? I suspect most of you are playing 'armchair politician' and really haven't supported the TiCats by attending games. I hope city council gets this one right and votes East Mountain.

[Wild Bill]

I'm starting to wonder if these difficulties are because M.E.N. are in charge...next time, give the task to women.

[Nelson Phillips]

Hamilton........ You're going to miss the boat again and it ain't leaving from the West Harbour!!!

[Bill]

Great to hear the Ti-Cats are leaving the City of Hamilton. Great job. Hamilton is losing respect everyday. It's a crap city and always will be. That's why I moved out. Just look at the downtown, what am saying, what downtown....lol

[Nigel Davenport]

First of all...the irresponsible journalism displayed by the Spectator and its overwhelming support of a West Harbour location is to be condemned. The op ed pages are selectively in favour of this location. Shame on you. You are a Toronto business entity (Torstar) that should stay out of Hamiltons affairs!
There are NO benefits to a West Harbour location. The traffic congestion displayed at Bayfront on Canada day was ridiculous. Observers of fireworks were treated to a minimum one hour drive from the foot of Guise Street just to King Street....and this without the pleasure of listening to CHML's 5th Quarter after a Ti-Cat win!
I've heard those who say people will stop and shop and spend money in the downtown area with a West Harbour site. Bologna!
Nobody is going to take their eyes off their wallets or purses as they pass the throngs of miscreants en route to the stadium from King & James. Who could blame them? I don't ever recall looking for trendy shops on Cannon Street or Barton Street to spend money in....have you? Do you want to see a football game or do you want to go shopping for a new pair of shoes. C'mon....get in the game.
The East Mountain will attract travellers from abroad given its easy access to the highways. I grew up on the East Mountain and made my way to Civic Stadium and Ivor Wynne Stadium. Now people below the hill can have their turn. It's no big deal and your bus ride (for the consummate beer lovers) is free!
I want the East Mountain site. It's no closer for me to travel....but I can get to the game and get out as I please.
That's my rant.

[Wild Bill]

Someone asked "How do the Alouettes succeed in a stadium with NO parking and NO highway access?"
Well, maybe it's because Montreal has a public transit system that WORKS! Actually, any other city's transit system works better than ours!
Anyone who believes that if Hamilton gets a West Harbour stadium they will have an easy bus ride from Stoney Creek, the mountain or Ancaster is dreaming in technicolour. Council will be promising that for the next 40 years!

[James Scearce]

Something tells me the comments against the West Harbour location are being posted by ficticious people by the Tiger-Cats, the comments run from non-sensical to ludicrous.

Considering the tactics the Tiger-Cats have used, it wouldn't surprise me one bit.

No one in their right mind believes the Tiger-Cats would leave a proven CFL city with a brand new stadium in the West Harbour... for where? Quebec City? Are they going to play on the Plains of Abraham?

This latest move by Bob Young is the worst bluff I've ever seen, and shows me he never intended to put one penny into any new stadium, including his covetted Satellite City, out of town, "have a drink and drive the Linc" stadium.

[Gene Simmons]

I'm starting to wonder if these difficulties are because M.E.N. are in charge...next time, give the task to women.

[john]

Bob, don't let the door hit you on the ass, on the way out.

[Mark D.]

Hamilton has screwed up everything it has tried to do for over 50 years and this is nothing new. I hope Council realises that their jobs are finished if the Ti-Cats leave town. We almost lost the Bulldogs to our Mayor's dismissive attitude towards them during the Jim Balsillie debacle, and now he's urinating on the Ti-Cats. Hamilton deserves to lose the team and revert back to the lunch-bucket dump it has always been. Bob Young owns the team, has bled real dollars to keep it here, and has every right to move it where he feels he can make a return on his investment. Hamilton will remain the laughing stock of the country, again!
I am so glad I don't live there anymore.

[Kate]

Tom, what vote are you talking about. Bob Young had his tantrum before the vote was even taken. For all he or anybody else knows the council would have voted for the east mountain. This has nothing to do with making a new stadium work, just with the tiger cats getting maximum profit and public dollars.

[Tom]

I hope the people that vote against the east mountain site(and the Ti-Cats) are starting to think about their last days in City Hall.

[Kathy]

I sent the mayor and the member of council for my ward a message.
No Ti-Cats, No stadium = no vote from me.
Unfortunately every councillor is going to get painted with the same brush on this one ~ it will be one too many opportunities lost at the hands of city council.

I am very very disappointed in the way city council has handled (read bungled) this situation and at such a great cost to this city and its citizens.

[West Harbour Support]

Good Job for mayor Fred, God forbid we finally have a mayor who has a pair and stands up for the city against a little whiny runt who cries because tax money isnt being spent on the site he wants. In a poll released by Angus Reid it states that 51% for west harbour VS. 49% for east mountain. Im sorry to all you east mountain supporters but we west harbour supporters out number you and our mayor is standing up for this city and what is right.

If you don't like it, there is a pretty good realty market in Burlington, maybe you can move there and watch the Pan-Am games from across the bay.

[Mike Russell]

I have read most of the comments here and I have yet to see any East Mountain supporter give a good and rational reason why the stadium should be built on the East Mountain. The usual response is the Ticats say it's not financially viable. If so then prove it. The Ticats have been asked over and over for those reports and have still not produced them. Why not? I'll tell you why, they don't exist.

The reality is it doesn't matter where they locate the stadium the Ticats will not be viable financially. The only team that made money in the CFL last year was Saskatchewan and thats because they are community owned team and run all sorts of fundraisers for the team.

As for the location of the stadium, the Ticats knew 2 years ago where the stadium would be built. It was part of the bid presentation for the Pan Ams. They knew that the city was planning to put it in the West Harbour.

Why did they not raise their objections then. Why did Bob Young state in January of this year that he would work with whatever location the city chose? Why did they wait until the eleventh hour to raise their objections?

Could it be that they are trying to put the city in a position where they have to make a hurried and uninformed decision based on emotion rather than on fact. Facts which all point to the West Harbour as the best location.

The other thing I keep reading from the East Mountain supporters is that a stadium at the West Harbour will be a white elephant. I've got news for you it doesn't matter where the stadium is built, it is going to be a white elephant. Most facilities that the city builds are white elephants. Libraries, parks, recreation centres and arenas are all white elephants and much more costly to operate than a stadium. It's just one of those things we pay for as taxpayers to enhance our enjoyment of this city or any city for that matter.

Hopefully. city council will make a rational decision based on fact and not emotion and reaffirm the choice of the West Harbour as the location of the stadium.

As for the Ticats threat to leave, see ya. We don't take kindly to threats in this city. I am sure you will find another city willing to spend a couple hundred million to build a new stadium or not. Good luck with that.

End of rant.

[Peter]

Congratualtions Freddy and your band of short sighted city councillors. You have failed to listen to any rational argument as to why the staduim should not be placed in the WH. Experts have concluded, as well as businessmen, that a stadium will not work in the WH yet Freddy still pushes for it. To all who think that a WH will revitalize downtown you need to get a grip on the reality of the situation. It won't, plain and simple. You WH supporters continue to bash Mr. Young even though he has lost tens of millions. You are ignorant and short sighted. Mr. Young wants a stadium where he can run a business successfully and make a profit. Instead, WH supporters don't seem to care that he would continue to lose money at this site. If all businesses ran on this type of model all you WH supporters would have no job becasue no one would be making money! I guess the concept of profit and sustainability eludes you. The real tragedy of this fiasco is it will be far reaching. In other words, businesses will not be looking to locate here because of inept leadership. The NHL, I am sure, is watching all this unfold and saying to themselves that this is not a place they will ever consider coming to because decisions can't be made. Maple Leaf Foods wanted to locate and build a huge plant here which would have created hundreds of higher paying jobs yet city council screwed that up too. Why? Because they listened to a vocal minority and not to rational thought. I am sure many other businesses took notes on that one and decided Hamilton is a no go. When city councillors can't make a decision they hire consultants and pay them a lot of money. That's leadership at its finest! So congrats again Freddy and city council - you have screwed Hamilton over again. Good luck in the next election because you will need it.

[Tara]

I say we let the citizens of Hamilton decide what should happen to the Hamilton Tiger-CAts and i am for one in favor of keeping them here forever, whether they win or lose i still support them 100% and i think re-locating the Tiger-Cats will take away Hamilton spirit.
if the blogger will permit
http://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#!/pages/Tiger-Cats-To-Stay-in-Hamilton/144296132267257?ref=mf
this link is for a petition to keep Hamilton's Tiger-Cats here!

[Peter Michael]

I agree with Bob and guest. All those crying that Bob Young is throwing a tantrum and being a baby have obviously never owned a business or know how to run one. At the end of the day, you have to do what's best for your business, even if a few customers don't like it.

It would be sad to see the Ticats leave and have Hamilton lose a professional sports franchise. Just another blemish on a city that tries to be in the big leagues but doesn't have the balls when it's time to step up and do what's go for all. Our city council has done this to us. Let's be sure to remember this at the next election.

[The Truth]

So the Cats might leave? Oh, boo-hoo (insert sarcasm here). The CFL will become irrelevant when the NFL expands into Canada anyway.

Bob Young is an extortionist.

[outtamyway]

"We will make it work, whatever the site."

Bob Young, January 10, 2010

"We will play out our days at Ivor Wynne"

Bob Young, August 9, 2010

[Bob Hunter]

I am a Hamilton business man that owns 4 properties in the city and pays taxes on each on of them. I would not locate my businesses in the West Harbour because it does not make sense to throw money away and lose money when my customers and suppliers do not support depressed areas to conduct their business.. Once I get back into the city from a business trip I will be doing the following in the very near future.
1. Cancel my subscription to the biased Hamilton Spectator for their over zealous support of the West Harbour.
2. Support Bob Young in any way I can even if he moves the Ticats. He is a businessman who has a right to make make some monies on his investment.
3. Support any candidate than runs again the present city councilman.
4. Vote The Mayor, Fred Eisenberger out of office.
5.Look for the real facts and let our citzens know the truth.
I will never support the present council in their endeavours in the West Harbour and will be looking for opportunities outside our city in the future.
The people who are supporting the West Harbour are looking for a miracle worker that think supporting this area in this manner will bring back our city to its once great status in Canada. The time has passed and people must look at the true facts. A stadium is not even a small piece to the puzzle when the true puzzle is to build affordable housing in the West Harbour along with parks, area to host many different functions.

[Myopinion]

How can some people be so naive? Bob Young has been planning this from day one. He was probably in negotiations with Quebec early on in the process. He just wanted to see if he could score a sweet deal in Hamilton before having to leave. No that he thinks the deal he wanted isn't going to happen, he comes out with this letter, saying there is nothing he can do. He was going to leave anyway folks. This just makes him look like less of a bad guy.

[Guest]

I give full marks to Bob Yonge. Hamilton has been living in the dark ages since the passing of a great mayor Victor copps who had a vision about the future of Hamilton. Todays council is a complete circus in the fact that they couldn't agree to what kind of asphalt to use when building a new road. The city politicions should be proud to have the ONLY professional franchise in the City, yet they can't work together. And after all this circus at City Hall, the idea of getting an NHL franchise for this City is another joke to laugh about as after seeing this shirade do you think a team would want to come to Hamilton? The only thing I could say to Hamiltonians is this. This is 2010 and not 1940 era. Start thinking like 2010 and move the city forward. Hamilton will never be on the world stage if this type of behavior continues at City Hall. The only stage Hamilton will ever be on is in a circus.

Guest

[James Scearce]

It's time to call Bob Young's bluff.

I appreciate what Bob Young has accomplished while owning the Tiger-Cats... he has made Ivor Wynne a fun place to go during his tenure as owner, despite the loust record of the team. He has done a good job and I can't fault him for wanting a location where he will make more revenue by charging $20 per parking spot and $9.50 per tallboy of Coors Lite.

But he won't contribute one cent toward this stadium, no matter what he says. He simply wants to take advantage of all this new found government money that appeared when Southern Ontario won the Pan-Am games bid.

Sorry Bob, we know you're not going anywhere especially if a stadium gets built in west harbour. History shows there are 8 or 9 cities than can support CFL football. And would you really leave one of those markets with a shiny new stadium that will probably sell-out for the first three of four years of it's existence, just out of curiousity sake from the fanbase?

With a new stadium (regardless of location), the Tiger Cats are actually one of the more attractive teams for the next several CFL seasons. Could the rumours of Bob Young's cash flow running low be behind much of these recent shennanigans?

Sorry Bob, I don't buy your bluff, I don't think city council will either.

[guest]

So I guess the question is "Does Hamilton want a CFL football team"?

All cities with pro teams need to compromise with the team owners.

If Hamlton doesn't want a professional sports team then another city will build the stadium and the team will move.

[Graham Carroll]

Goodbye Cats.

While it saddens me to think of the Cats leaving all I can say under these circumstances is don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out Bob.

It is beyond time we pull out of a new stadium, put a coat of paint on Ivor Wynne and move along to the next non crisis. I do like the idea of the amphitheater on the Rheem site though.

I guess I can thank Bob for that one good idea.

[SEE YA!]

EXTORTIONIST, EXTORTIONIST, EXTORTIONIST- BOB YOUNG IS AN EXTORTIONIST AT THE EXPENSE OF OUR PUBLIC PURSE. the cats have been subsidized by this city by tens of millions of dollars, they are a welfare case and to try to extort our city of Hamilton at the 11th hour is downright DESPICABLE. they are subsidized 1.3 million yearly and Hamilton makes absolutely NO REVENUE FROM THEM. THEY KEEP ALL THE REVENUES AND WE PAY ALL THE EXPENSES. to EXPECT THE CITIZENS OF HAMILTON TO HAND OVER A BLANK CHEQUE - IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN- so bobby, take your 3rd rate team and your bullying ways and make heed to Quebec! i do feel sorry for them though.